042: Writing Through Life with Amber Starfire - Betsy Pake

042: Writing Through Life with Amber Starfire

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Amber Lea Starfire is an author, editor, and creative writing coach whose passion is helping others tell their stories. Her most recent books include Not the Mother I Remember: A Memoir — finalist for the 2015 Next Generation Indie Book Awards and the 2013-2014 Sarton Women’s Literary Awards — and Week by Week: A Year’s Worth of Journaling Prompts & Meditations. Amber is also co-editor of the award-winning anthology, Times They Were A-Changing: Women Remember the ’60s & ’70s. Her creative nonfiction and poetry have appeared in numerous anthologies and literary journals. Amber earned her MFA in Creative Writing from University of San Francisco and an MA in Education from Stanford University. She has a writing and publishing-oriented online classes website and blog at writingthroughlife.com

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Writing is a lot like giving birth, right? You work for months and months. And when you finally have something that you want to share with the world, you hope that people see it the way you see it. And it gets like in the back of your head, you know that that could never ever be. But I have a deep and indescribable gratitude for my guest. Today, she encouraged me, she calmed me down, she used humor to help me see a different angle. And honestly, she told me when it was time to just hit Delete. She had empathy and excitement. And she helped me to create something better, and to learn new skills that I could only ever dream of. So I am forever in gratitude. And I want to share her with you today. She’s got some really cool things to say about writing and sharing your story and developing a voice of your own. So I’m anxious to share this interview and this guest with you today. Welcome to the art of living big. My name is Betsy Pake entrepreneur, author and personal success coach. This is the show that brings you stories and small ideas to help you live a big life. I hope this once a week podcast will inspire you, motivate you and encourage you to think differently about what could be possible for your life. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let’s go live big. All right. Hey, everybody, welcome to the next episode of The Art of Living big. I’m here with my friend amber Starfire. And she has a special place in my heart. We’re gonna talk about that. But Amber, welcome to the show. Thank you.

Pleasure to be here. Yeah, I’m,

I’m so pumped. You’re here? Because truly, um,

well, we’ll get into what one of the reasons that I love you so much. But tell everybody a little bit about you. And what you do?

Sure. Well, I’m an author, a memoir, author, and nonfiction author. And I also edit and I’m a writing coach as well. So I really dedicate my life to empowering other writers to tell their stories. And that’s my tagline helping you bring your true stories to life.

Which is that’s really cool. Because a lot of people have a story, right? Don’t you find that most people even if they never thought about writing a book, they have some sort of story they want to tell?

Yes, I believe everyone has a story and that everyone’s story is unique. And one of the reasons that memoir is such a popular genre is because we find in other people’s stories, those commonalities that that universal human experience that we can relate to, and it encourages us, it helps us realize we can get through anything.

Yeah, yeah, I really like that. Yeah. So when you read about somebody else that was able to do something hard or something difficult, or something that you’re faced with it, like sort of increases your belief that you can do it too.

Which is exactly like super powerful.

It is yes. So how can fiction has that as well? I mean, I’ve edited a number of fiction books as well. And I think writing in general, is transformative. It’s always about transformation of some sort. Hmm,

yeah, like that. So

I want to talk about that. And then I also want to talk about how you got into this whole thing. So tell me more about that. It’s transformative.

Tell me more.

Well, if you think about it, the memoir and stories like that are all about a overcoming something a hardship, a loss, you know, some kind of illness, they’re always about transformation or something that someone has learned from life experience. The same is true of fiction, where we have the hero who comes through some horrible events or, you know, comes through something that has challenged them. And there’s the main conflict that they come through, it’s the hero’s journey. And I think even in nonfiction, you know, we are always looking for something that’s going to, to help us transform our lives. I mean, that’s, that’s the purpose of, of living big, right? It’s, if we’re looking for this way or a path to transform ourselves, and to always reach our potential and, and all of the stories that we hear that we read, inform us about how to go about doing that.

Yeah, like that. So do you think that people

actually writing even if they don’t ever publish anything, but just to have that experience of like writing or journaling can be, like a really powerful thing?

Oh, absolutely. I as you know, I also teach journaling classes, and I promote journaling on my website. And I do this because I think that’s how a lot of people start writing is by writing in their journals by processing daily. And I think, well not only have have the benefits of journal journaling been well documented, it’s it’s a kind of a spiritual process where you’re really digging down self discovery, you’re processing emotions, you’re dealing with stress. So it does a lot of things for you, both on a physical, mental and emotional areas of your life. And I think writing, as we graduate, we know we come from journaling, some people, that’s fine, that’s all they want. That’s all they need. Their net, their intention is not to publish, maybe they’re writing stories for their grandkids. That’s, that’s great. I think we need those legacies. And that’s fine. But there’s a group of people who who want more, and they want their stories to get out there for other people to read. And so when that happens, I like to be there to help bring that about to help them learn their craft, learn how to how to tell what it is that they want to tell. Hmm.

So tell me, I want to go into the journaling class that you offer a little bit like what? How do you teach somebody how to journal?

Funny, doesn’t it? Yeah. So well, I have an an email course that a lot of people start with, which is just called journaling one on one. And it’s an introduction to journaling. And it includes journaling prompts. And so my course is I have two courses, one is called 30 days to deeper journaling. And in that one, I really it’s a, it’s an intentional journey that starts with setting intention, you know, what, what is your intention? What is it that you want to get out of this course, and then moves through a series of writing prompts that takes people deeper and deeper into their kind of subconscious area, I use a lot of imagination techniques. We take things like their biggest challenges, like fears, or, you know, maybe something in their life that they’re trying to overcome. And we personify it and we write letters to and from it, we have it speak. And when that happens when they personify a fear and actually, you know, put a face on it, it’s amazing the power that that has to help understand their fears, and then under also understand the benefits that those fears have brought to them, and then they can develop a partnership with it instead of feeling controlled by it.

That’s super cool. I love that idea.

Do you know Jensen? cero. Do you know who she is? She wrote that book, you are a badass, which was

No, I haven’t read it

yet. So it’s a good book, but she just came out with

another one. You are a badass with money. And I thought it was interesting. I like her style of writing. And so I like to I like to read her books or listen to them on Audible. Anyway, she, she talked about doing an exercise where you write a letter to money as if it was your friend, right, which is personifying. Mm hmm. And it was weirdly powerful. Like, I didn’t realize what a crappy friend I am. Money, wrote my letter, you know, so I can Yeah, it can be really, really powerful.

Exactly. And we do have interesting relationships with money. And so that would definitely work with money as well.

So when somebody goes through, I see, I didn’t know

you had this journaling, CLABSI. I’m learning stuff, even though I know you. So I’m sort of excited and intrigued by that. So somebody can go to your website, and I’ll make sure to put a link in the show notes so they can find you know, where they can find this. But that

sounds really cool.

And we’ve talked on the show before about journaling. And we’ve talked about like getting into your beliefs, trying to figure out what your story is, when having those prompts, I can see that being so, so helpful, because people have written to me and said like, I just have a really hard time with that. But if you have prompts and you sort of are spurred on so you know where to go. That’s, that’s really cool.

Right? And, and also, I provide what I call food for thought. So every day, there are quotes or videos or images or things that that help people kind of move into the topic and think about it maybe from another perspective and think about it in a new way. And I have another course called journaling for memoir, which is really geared for people who are who want to write memoir, and it helps them it’s kind of a prewriting for more. So it helps them begin to flesh out some of the events in their lives. And again, it uses a writing process, but it’s more geared around really finding the meaning in those events. Yeah, identifying them finding the meaning and then being able to write about it in a very non threatening, safe space. When you’re writing in your journal. Your your inner critic is not in the room, you know, you’re not looking over your own shoulder. Am I good enough writer and do is this sentence, right? Should I use this verb, you know, that’s not in the room that’s not happening. So when you have your journal and you’re writing in your journal, it’s a very safe way to process things and then you can take what you’ve gained, and move into the actual writing.

Yeah, I like that. Because I could see that being like a

powerful thing where now you’re, you know, you’re writing and you’re getting your own stuff out, which is huge and huge in your own processing. But then if you think about somebody else actually looking at it, it takes on a whole other life like it looks same words, but they look different to you suddenly.

Exactly, exactly. And another technique that I have for helping people to look at themselves is to write about themselves in third person instead of I know, yeah, she you are he? And when you’re writing about yourself in third person, it’s amazing what, how you can use your imagination, and then be actually a little more honest.

Yeah, yeah. Well, do you think do you find people are

Kinder when they do it

like that? Because we’re awful self critical, but I wonder if when we’re looking at ourselves from the outside, if that softens a little bit, because we are, like, typically kinder to other people when we’re judging right?

Yeah, I hadn’t thought about it that way. But you’re absolutely right. That is part of what happens.

Yeah. Yeah, that’s really cool. So um, how did you

get into all this? Like, have you just been writing your whole life?

Pretty much. I started writing it. You know, in a diary, like a little girls, when I was probably about six or seven. When I was eight years old, I taught myself how to type. And that was one of the biggest gifts I ever gave myself, by the way, you know, because now, when I write I, I type very fast keyboard very fast, and probably about 90 words a minute. So I can almost write as fast as I think,

Hmm, yeah,

yeah. So you know, as the words come to me, and that that comes in handy, but yeah, and I’ve often on, you know, I’ve had periods of my life where I wasn’t writing for various reasons, or I wasn’t keeping a journal. Usually, those periods coincided with periods of very low self esteem. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. Cuz when you move away from something that you really love, or you move away from it, because of other things happening, like it’s probably a combination of things holding you back, right? Mm hmm.

Yes. And it really wasn’t until about, I want to say 10 or 12 years ago that I began to allow myself to think of myself as a writer. You know what I mean? Yeah, it’s that sense of, well, I’ve been writing, but does that make me a writer? You know, if I say I’m a writer, the first thing people ask is, well, what’s your book? You know, what have you published? Yeah. And, you know, it’s hard to recognize the fact that you’re writing every day. Does that make you a writer? You know, and I believe it does. And it was what turned that around for me was actually being very intentional about my writing, I began to recognize I had been doing a lot of writing for years technical writing, writing manuals, and, you know, human resources, guides and all kinds of things like that for business. Yeah, so my business writing was definitely something that was taking up a big part of my life, but I didn’t count it. And I one day, I decided to start counting it. And I began looking at all the writing, I was doing emails, texts, you know, business writing, and my personal writing my journaling my little short stories that never saw the light of day. And I began to say, you know what, I’m going to, I’m going to treat all of this as if it’s real. And I’m a writer, and it transformed the way I thought about myself. And it really enabled me to step into that now, simultaneously, I’ve pretty much always been a teacher as well. So I have been teaching for over 25 years in various topic areas, including computer applications to ballroom dance to business and creative writing. So now I’m focused more on what I really love, which is writing and, and life story and story in general.

So which is that memoir piece? Yes, they are checking them out. So yeah, that’s really interesting. And yeah, and that’s something that I have thought about myself, too. It’s like, what, what, what makes and I have even said, like, but I’m not a writer, and my ex husband actually said to me, Well, Betsy, I think you are now

I’m an author, but I’m not a writer. Let’s see. Yeah,

right. Right. Because there is something to be a writer means that you’re, I don’t know. It’s, there’s something different about it. What is that? What is that feeling that I have?

Yeah, I don’t know. I don’t know. I think that we we tie that up? It’s like saying, I’m an artist, you know, but if you’re not making money and having shows at galleries, maybe it’s just a hobby,

right? Yes. Yeah, it’s a value thing, right. It’s like how you have to be a certain level or good at it. enough to be That thing, right?

Right? saying I’m a writer doesn’t mean I’m a great writer just means I’m a writer.

Yeah, that’s true. Because Yeah, can I say I’m a mom all the time and like today, I have not been a great mom.

We do that in all areas of our life.

Right? We’re working on our skills.

That’s right.

Well, I found you and you actually edited my book, the star small, live big. And I, you know, I mean, I don’t even have words it. I am so grateful and thankful that I found you, I don’t know what I would have done. If I’d found somebody else that really wasn’t as committed to getting this thing out of my brain like you were. And I think it make you Yeah, I think it makes a huge difference when you have somebody that just sort of gets you. And, you know, although I had written my become a nutrition NINJA book, that was a very different kind of book. And this was something where I really needed like, an editor, but I also needed somebody that really was trying to seek what my message really was, and to help me get it out. And my god, how many times did I use the word things? You were like, okay, so there’s things written like 27 times what things are. It’s good stuff. Like, I was so grateful that you were, like, just so kind. And you were like, that’s okay, we’re gonna learn. And this will make you a better writer, which was so so true. Like, I think, now, if I were to write that same book, or when I write my next book, it will be like, so much different. Because of that experience.

Yeah, each time we write, and each time we publish, you know, I look back on things that I wrote earlier. You know, you always want to go back and go, Oh, I want to change that. But you learn from it. And so I’m, my first drafts now are a lot better than they were 10 years ago. Oh, right. Yeah. And I think that’s true of anyone who who goes at it with intention. I mean, if a person says I’m not a writer, that means they don’t write, and they’re not interested in writing. Hmm.

Yeah. It’s funny, because when I, I guess, when the book first came out, I emailed you and asked you if you’d come on the show, and you thought you messaged me back, but I never got your message. And so I thought, Oh, my God, I’ve killed her lady. She’s jumped off a bridge. Or she was like, Dear God, don’t have that woman emailed me ever again, because I’m afraid she’ll ask me to edit her next book. Don’t make it. So I was really excited when I finally I heard from you. And you were like, Hey, I’m not sure if I messaged you back. So. So yeah, so I’m glad that you’re on. Because I think a lot of people listening, do have ideas in their head and to take that leap to go like, Okay, I’m going to actually try to publish something, or I’m going to actually try to get these words out of my head, or this idea out of my brain and into something that I can look at. Like that can be a big jump for people. And then they don’t even they don’t take the leap, because they don’t even know what they would do next. So if somebody was going to do this and have this journey, what would what would you say? Like, what does that journey look like for someone?

Well, I get asked the question a lot, how do I get started? And my answer is always to just start. I know that sounds simple. And maybe it is simple. It is easy. Is it small? Is it starting small, it’s starting small it is it is exactly that it is sit down and write for 10 minutes, 15 minutes, get those thoughts out on the page, don’t be concerned with whether those thoughts are unique, or whether anyone’s going to buy them, or whether they’re great. Or just get them if if it’s nagging at you. My philosophy is if you’ve got something burning, and you to say it needs to be said somebody needs to hear it. Yeah. And I kind of like in this, I’ve always been kind of a big mouth. I mean, I you know, when I was a little girl, I was always criticized for talking too much being too loud. All those things that girls aren’t supposed to be. And I would hold back and hold back and hold back and I’d be bursting. I do one of those little kids in class who was always raising their hand and the teacher was trying to look around you or anybody else, you know, and it’s because I had these burning things I wanted to say and it wasn’t until I finally came around to the idea that that was okay, that I could ask questions that I could say things and that usually somebody else in the room or somebody else would say, you know, I was thinking that same thing, but I was too afraid to say it. When I started getting that feedback, I realized that my voice had a place in the world. And I think it’s true of everyone. So that’s my advice. If you’ve got something that’s burning inside you to say it’s nagging at you and you don’t know if you’re good enough If anybody else is interested, I say go for it. Because I believe that if if that’s burning, then someone else needs to hear it.

I love that my voice had a place in this world, like, that’s powerful stuff.

Yeah, it was and is and continues to be for me.

And I think sometimes people think like, you know, somebody else has already thought about it, or someone else has already done it or, you know, I wouldn’t be able to do it as good. You know, I can write my book, but it won’t be as good as Jensen chair rose, you know, like, I could write something. But I do think there’s something about, like creating something that came out of you, right? So it’s unique in that it, nobody else could have said it in the same way that you can. Exactly. And that kind of gives you power. To try other things that have nothing to do with writing, don’t you think it’s sort of like leaks over into other areas of your life where you’re like, maybe I have more value in other areas, too.

Yeah, I mean, anytime you’re empowered in one area of your life, that’s going to, as you say, leak over into other areas, you’re going to begin to be feel braver, feel ready to risk. And that’s what it is, it’s a risk. When you write, you’re putting a little piece of yourself out in the world. And it’s scary, someone might step on it, you know, someone might reject it, someone might tell you, it’s not interesting. But, you know, like you say, every person has a unique view, they’re there, you know, there’s nothing new under the sun, that’s the truth. Creativity, the way that we humans do, it doesn’t mean bringing something out of nothing, it means taking substances that we have at hand, and rearranging them reforming them. It’s like clay, you know, clay is clay, and we all have it, we can we can create different types of art with it, or different types of jars or whatever we’re doing or vases. And so the same is true of our writing. We all have the same words, perhaps in different languages, but we all have the same words. And we’re just shaping them in different ways. And we’re making what we have to say accessible to those who want or need to hear it. Mm hmm.

Yeah, I like that a lot. So I remember when I finished my manuscript,

and it may

have been after you, it probably was after you got a hold of it. And you helped shine that thing up hidden. I remember, I had it in my hand, and I had it all printed out. And there was a moment I was standing in my kitchen. And there was a moment where I was looking at it. And I thought like this panic, because now it was done. Right. So yeah, you had. So now it was done. And now I have to do the next thing, which is to share it. Right. So now it’s gonna go to the publisher, and then oh, my God, people are gonna see it. And they’re gonna judge me. Right? Yeah, I remember I had a moment where I threw it on the kitchen island. And I said to my daughter, that it that’s separate from me. So it came out of me, but it’s separate now. Because now it’s on paper. Now it’s separate. And if somebody doesn’t like it, it doesn’t mean, it doesn’t have anything directly about me. You know, it doesn’t mean they don’t like me, or it doesn’t mean I’m not enough, or it doesn’t mean like I can never write anything different or better. Like, it just means that thing that I created, they may not like, and it felt like a moment of like freedom, like, do you know what I’m saying? Like having

a great attitude to take? Yeah, that’s a great attitude. Because it’s not. It’s not user judging. It’s the it’s the message. It’s the book. It’s no, maybe it’s not for them? No, there are, what we write is not for everybody. There’s always an intended not intended audience. For you, it’s it’s, you know, for your book, it’s people who want to live more up to their potential want to live bigger lives, but don’t know how to get started. Don’t know what to do. Yeah. And so the message is, you know, you assess, and you make some really small baby steps. And that’s where you start. Yeah,

yeah.

Yeah. And so like, if somebody didn’t like that it was made, because they didn’t need that. Like, maybe they already had a way of getting their steps and moving forward, you know, so yeah, so that was a powerful thing. You know, what’s funny is I’ve been speaking a lot about the book almost every week, I’ve had a speech and yesterday, I traveled from Atlanta, where I live to Birmingham and spoke for a corporation Air Force in association. And when I was done, I talked about Chase, which, you know, we defined in the book as having this framework to move through. And people came to me after and said, we’re not going to have vision parties anymore. You know, those vision board parties, people would have Yes, we’re gonna have chase my big life parties. And I thought humdinger, that’s why I wrote it, you know?

So that you person that I just met yesterday,

could take it and make something of it and go create something of your own from it. Do you know what I mean? That was such a cool moment, because I was like, I got this thing out. And now somebody else can take it and make it a little bit of their thing was super cool.

It’s very fulfilling, isn’t it?

Yeah, yeah. And so now I’m like, sort

of like everybody, if you have an idea, or you have a dream, you know, reconnect to that thing, and start taking the steps to do it. Because getting it out

can really help

not only you live bigger,

but other people too. Mm hmm.

And, you know, it doesn’t mean that you’re not going to make mistakes or fail or fall down. That’s how we learn to walk, you know, we fall down a lot. And every time something doesn’t work, you know, if we take it and we look at it and say, Okay, what do I need to do to balance better or to make this work, then we can, you know, our first book launch might not go off very well, we might, you know, not get it out to the people who need to hear it. So we have to take a look and go, Okay, what did I do? What did I miss? You know, what should I have done? Yeah. And so every step is a learning is a part of learning. And and when we recognize that we stop fearing the risk, we stop fearing failure. Hmm, yeah. Or at least not fearing it as much.

Anytime you’re creative, it feels risky,

don’t you think? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I think and and the other thing is, if you want to be more creative, limit yourself. And I know that sounds weird. But when I used to teach desktop publishing way back when, and I learned this message, if I gave my students very limited ability, like, okay, you have to work in three colors. And you have to do this and this and this, and I really limited their boundaries, they will, but you all have to do something different with it, they would get so creative. But if you give people too much to work with too much choice, they get overwhelmed by it. So that’s the other thing. Just focus in limit yourself to one little area. And then when you have those limits, and you have to, to create something that Trent that transcends those limits, it’s amazing. What what comes out of us.

Yeah, I like that a lot. Like that’s a really good thought. And especially like, if you’re trying to work through something like stop giving yourself so many options, and just limit your options and see if you can come up with a solution for whatever your struggle is. Yep. Mm hmm. I like that sort of, like when you go to the grocery store, and they have so many different kinds of cereal, just give me like two or three kinds. Right?

Right. Exactly. I think of children, you know, when they’re little, I don’t know what age your kids are. But, you know, if you ask a little kid, what their what they want to wear today, they’re gonna stomp around, I don’t want to get dressed, you know, you know, but if I pull out two outfits, and you say which one of these Do you want to wear? They still have choice, yet. They feel like, okay, you know, they’re gonna choose one, and you’re gonna get less grief from them about it, it’s less choice, they get overwhelmed if they have too much choice. And I think as adults, we’re the same way, when we have a lot of options. And I think those of us with a lot of creative abilities in various areas sometimes get confused about which areas we want to follow, or what direction to go. So limit it, just focus in on one and see what happens.

Yeah, yeah, I like that a lot. And so maybe like, if someone’s listening, and they’re like, where do I start, they just start by journaling every morning, just writing whatever comes to their mind for 10 minutes. Right, good place to start.

Yep, and and those who remember, more mourning pages, the idea was to just write and keep writing. And even if you didn’t know what to write, you would write over and over again, I don’t know what to write, until eventually, something happened. I also have a book on writing prompts on journaling prompts, I think you know that it’s called week by week, a year’s worth of journaling prompts and meditation. And that’s focuses in on rather than sort of a daily. Here’s a random prompt for you to do today. It focuses on subject areas, so you can kind of go in and, and take a topic, say family relationships or spirituality or politics and write about it for a week. There’s seven, seven prompts, and kind of dig into it deeply. So that’s, hey, love that. Yeah, that’s awesome guidance for people as well, if they’re looking for ways to get started.

Yeah, yeah, that’s super cool. So they can head to your website and tell us the website address.

It’s writing through life. All one word.com. So right through is th r OUGH. So writing through life.com

Okay, and I’ll link to it in the show. It’s too but they can go there. They can find out more about you, they can see the different courses that you have. And it also links to your books if I remember right,

right. And I have been blogging on that site now for almost eight years. So I actually have thousands of articles on journaling, writing memoir on writing craft on the writers life and even on writing tools. I did a series on word for writers, for example, Microsoft, help people, you know, kind of get better with their tool.

So, is that what you what do you use when you write

like if you write a book? Do you just

I use Scrivener?

Oh, you do? Okay. Yeah. Which like blocks out. So you don’t have you know, you don’t see anything else. Right.

Right. Well, I, I just in fact, my most recent blog post was on Scrivener versus word. And they each have their place I use word for for final formatting generally. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So I’ll export to word and also if I’m going to share something,

and I know, I’ve used Emmet Hemingway before. And I tried it. Yeah. You know, it’s kind of weird, but I like it, because it like blocks everything else out. So then I don’t see. I’m not, like caught up with something else happening in my sidebar or whatever. But yeah, but I like it. And it’s just plain text, you know. So and which is sounds similar? I think it’s that’s similar to Scrivener.

Yeah, the thing I like about Scrivener for I don’t mind getting off topic here a little bit is that it is it keeps everything in one place. So all of my chapters, scenes, research, I can import all the research, all the webpages, everything can be all in one project file. So I don’t and it’s all I can reorganize by drop dragging and dropping. So you know, if you if you write fiction, it’s particularly useful, but even a nonfiction if you’re not sure what order your chapters are going to be in yet or quite yet, or your writing and scene and memoir, you can write the scenes each in separate little pages or documents within it. And then you just drag and drop them to rearrange them.

Oh, see, I really like that. I’m gonna have to check that out.

Yeah, because it gives you it’s really flexible in terms of structure. Yeah. So yeah, check out my blog post. See what you think. Yeah. And which just gives it kind of an overview of what the main differences are? between them? Yeah. Between word and Scrivener? Yeah. Cool. Yeah.

So this is so awesome. I appreciate you coming on. It was funny, because when we first got on the phone, although you think maybe we talked right when I first hired you for my book, but I was thinking we had never spoken before. But either way, we hadn’t spoken since you deleted all of my things from my knees. And, and made that thing, something that I could be proud of. So I am forever grateful, probably more so than I ever really expressed to you or that you could really understand because they don’t know that I would have been as proud to share the ideas that I had. Because when my ideas came out, I mean, they were great ideas, but they weren’t as they weren’t just as pretty as they were after you helped me out. So I appreciate you. And I’m so glad you came on the show and could share with people and I hope people go check out your website and just see all the coolest stuff you have to offer. I know I’m gonna check out definitely gonna get your book on journaling. But I’m gonna check out that course too, because that sounds just really like a cool way to sort of explore yourself.

Well, thank you. And I feel really honored to have worked with you and helps you with your book. I also felt really proud of it when it was done and you know it. It really goes a long way to fulfilling my purpose when I help anyone else. Say what’s in their heart to say so that’s that’s a big deal for me. So thank you.

Oh, yeah, that’s cool. Well, good.

All right. Well, thank you so much for being on here. You are just special person and I appreciate you taking the time to talk with everybody on the art of living big. Thanks for having me on your journey today. I want to invite you to jump inside our free Facebook group. You can find that at SS lb community calm that stands for start small, live big community.com and we can just continue the conversation in there. And as always, here’s a little message from my husband.

That’s it.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

HI, I'M YOUR HOST

Meet Betsy!

I'm Betsy Pake!

*Ocean obsessed

*Probably hanging out with my dogs

*Optimist

*Deep thinker

Hey There!

About Betsy

Hi I’m Betsy and I’m a subconscious change expert.
By day you can find me digging deep into the unconscious beliefs and identity of my clients so they can move past self-sabotage and lack of confidence and gain traction in their career and life.

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